Chapter - Mokushiroku no Yonkishi Chapter 189 Spoilers & Discussion | Page 2 | MangaHelpers

Chapter Mokushiroku no Yonkishi Chapter 189 Spoilers & Discussion

Talenel

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Really hoping Nasiens entire journey from here isnt going to revolve on their attraction to Percy.

Balin is doing very good so far...I may have underestimated him a bit.
 

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I'm beginning to feel that Nasiens is heading down the same path as their (or I guess it's now her) mother did sadly... Well at least we still got Anne and Gawain. Percy keeps making declarations that he'll never forgive Diodra, which I feel is gonna come back on him. So far Balin vs Gawain has been cool looking, and I guess next chapter it's gonna get even more brutish lol. I wonder if Balin is immune to teleportation, cause that was how Gawain got through Galand's defenses.
 

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You guys are thinking too much about Despair's power IMO. It's literally impossible for Percival to lose this fight. As shown in the previous chapter, even if Percival's attacks get reflected, he himself can heal.
 

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this chapter confirms gawain vs beltreipe.
 

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If there was any doubt left in anyone whether Balin was holding back massively against Howzer, this chapter confirms it, haha. Jesus Christ. This man is knocking on the gates of 4KotA-tier already. I can easily see how he was the previous champion, no ordinary fighter could hold a candle to him even if he didn't have his magic power. The speed, power and technique behind those attacks are the real deal. Gawain is by no means a slow-poke even in mini form and despite her almost instant teleportation he managed to graze her and that nick sent her flying. If it hadn't been for her flying ability in the first place she wouldn't have broke the acceleration behind it. Most other opponents would either have been cleft in half or gone ring-out.

Likewise, Gawain's display of magic in this chapter is also insane. I don't think we have seen anyone before "store" magic spells beforehand. Usually it goes [Incantation]->[Cast] but she can stack incants and then blast them off in a row. The magnitude of all three spells would have made any Commandment but the top brass in NNT sweat. It's crazy that she isn't even remotely close to running out of steam. We haven't even seen her go all out yet and use her maximum muscle form. The difference between her pre-timeskip form and the current one is worlds apart. You go, girl. How much insane training did you to, lol.

I guess Balin isn't going to swing around wildly anymore next chapter. Gawain can more than match that strength.
 

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If there was any doubt left in anyone whether Balin was holding back massively against Howzer, this chapter confirms it, haha. Jesus Christ. This man is knocking on the gates of 4KotA-tier already. I can easily see how he was the previous champion, no ordinary fighter could hold a candle to him even if he didn't have his magic power. The speed, power and technique behind those attacks are the real deal. Gawain is by no means a slow-poke even in mini form and despite her almost instant teleportation he managed to graze her and that nick sent her flying. If it hadn't been for her flying ability in the first place she wouldn't have broke the acceleration behind it. Most other opponents would either have been cleft in half or gone ring-out.

Likewise, Gawain's display of magic in this chapter is also insane. I don't think we have seen anyone before "store" magic spells beforehand. Usually it goes [Incantation]->[Cast] but she can stack incants and then blast them off in a row. The magnitude of all three spells would have made any Commandment but the top brass in NNT sweat. It's crazy that she isn't even remotely close to running out of steam. We haven't even seen her go all out yet and use her maximum muscle form. The difference between her pre-timeskip form and the current one is worlds apart. You go, girl. How much insane training did you to, lol.

I guess Balin isn't going to swing around wildly anymore next chapter. Gawain can more than match that strength.
I believe that it is exactly the power of the ritta axe that will defeat balin, a weapon imbued with magic, I have reasons for this

1- all the magics we saw that were nullifying were also broken with magic that imbued magic into weapons or body parts(the rulers dk and ds)

2- It is said that Balin defeated Gareth before Gareth himself even tried anything, this could mean that Balin could be affected by Soulfree, so he didn't wait to try to attack.

Perhaps Gawain stored some of his magical strength within Ritta so he could use it in a difficult fight, that fight is now.

some thought gawain would try a merlin strategy, but it looks like she's going to follow a escanor strategy 😂
 

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You guys are thinking too much about Despair's power IMO. It's literally impossible for Percival to lose this fight. As shown in the previous chapter, even if Percival's attacks get reflected, he himself can heal.
People are overhyping diodora in general tbh like yall he’s not a god let’s be serious about this 😭
 

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If there was any doubt left in anyone whether Balin was holding back massively against Howzer, this chapter confirms it, haha. Jesus Christ. This man is knocking on the gates of 4KotA-tier already. I can easily see how he was the previous champion, no ordinary fighter could hold a candle to him even if he didn't have his magic power. The speed, power and technique behind those attacks are the real deal. Gawain is by no means a slow-poke even in mini form and despite her almost instant teleportation he managed to graze her and that nick sent her flying. If it hadn't been for her flying ability in the first place she wouldn't have broke the acceleration behind it. Most other opponents would either have been cleft in half or gone ring-out.

Likewise, Gawain's display of magic in this chapter is also insane. I don't think we have seen anyone before "store" magic spells beforehand. Usually it goes [Incantation]->[Cast] but she can stack incants and then blast them off in a row. The magnitude of all three spells would have made any Commandment but the top brass in NNT sweat. It's crazy that she isn't even remotely close to running out of steam. We haven't even seen her go all out yet and use her maximum muscle form. The difference between her pre-timeskip form and the current one is worlds apart. You go, girl. How much insane training did you to, lol.

I guess Balin isn't going to swing around wildly anymore next chapter. Gawain can more than match that strength.
I am kinda like King. It's hard for me to be impressed by magic in general. It hasn't been well explained and we have only seen exceptional Mages. The most I have been impressed by Gawain's Magic is when she used AoE Absolute Cancel and when she used Teleportation to eviscerate Galan. I was expecting Gawain to use her Spells without chants after the timeskip but she still can't. I wonder if Nakaba is saving it for later or if he will leave her like that to give her a weakness(probably the former).


I believe that it is exactly the power of the ritta axe that will defeat balin, a weapon imbued with magic, I have reasons for this

1- all the magics we saw that were nullifying were also broken with magic that imbued magic into weapons or body parts(the rulers dk and ds)

2- It is said that Balin defeated Gareth before Gareth himself even tried anything, this could mean that Balin could be affected by Soulfree, so he didn't wait to try to attack.

Perhaps Gawain stored some of his magical strength within Ritta so he could use it in a difficult fight, that fight is now.

some thought gawain would try a merlin strategy, but it looks like she's going to follow a escanor strategy 😂
I don't think Gawain needs Rhitta specifically to defeat Balin, but she is using it because it's her ST so she is at her strongest with it. If Rhitta itself is needed then that would mean that Balin is truly pretty much... invincible :catshrug .
 

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When Balin's defence finally shatters do you think he will be elated or actually fold quickly because he has a super low pain treshhold because he barely remembers what pain even is?
 

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When Balin's defence finally shatters do you think he will be elated or actually fold quickly because he has a super low pain treshhold because he barely remembers what pain even is?
I don't think this will be a problem :XD.
 

Talenel

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Gotta admit, even with this translation I'm not sure what Balin in communicating to Diodra

"Friendship is for the weak....but maybe you don't get to decide that?" Le what?

Not sure whose theory it was but my brain keeps tying Balin back to the Demon King. If his magic was The Ruler, wouldn't he get stronger when hit by magic? I don't know if that's something Gawain can clock.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

I don't think it will be a problem either but it would be funny if he started to shrink away because he got a little boo-boo lol
That would parallel with Gawain throwing a tantrum after being chin checked.
 
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Hmmm, still a relatively uninteresting chapter. More of nasien's utterly uninteresting love live and a rivalry I can't even begin to care about. I suppose part of this is that I don't really buy characters in the story actually liking percy like that.

The fight between gawain and balin was also uneventful in a sense. I hope we get to see a bit more of how gawain's sunshine works. I feel like there should be some BS behind the rules she plays under as when it came to mael and escanor they operated with the same rules.
 

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Hmmm, still a relatively uninteresting chapter. More of nasien's utterly uninteresting love live and a rivalry I can't even begin to care about. I suppose part of this is that I don't really buy characters in the story actually liking percy like that.

The fight between gawain and balin was also uneventful in a sense. I hope we get to see a bit more of how gawain's sunshine works. I feel like there should be some BS behind the rules she plays under as when it came to mael and escanor they operated with the same rules.
Merlin obviously she probably knows more about Sunshine than even the Supreme Deity.
 

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Regarding Balin's magic, invincible characters basically always have some kind of a weakness to their invulnerability and I expect this to be true for Balin as well. For the sake of keeping things balanced this weakness should be something relatively simple that most capable fighters could take advantage of in the right circumstances, rather than something very specific and gimmicky. It could be as straightforward as a time limit to how long he can keep his magic active at a time, forcing him to toggle his magic on and off as needed. This would mean that rather than being constantly invulnerable, Balin is actually only activating his magic whenever he knows he's about to get hit. The way to get around that is an attack that he can't see coming or that is so fast he can't react to it in time. Alternatively it would be possible to just keep constantly barraging him with attacks without any breaks until his magic hits its time limit and deactivates automatically.

Another more interesting option would be some sort of a weak point similar to Achilles and his heel. Anyone striking Balin in that location could bypass his invincibility and perhaps enhance the damage so that even a small wound would be enough to defeat him. As for where this weak point could be located, I think it would make sense for Balin to cover that spot with his clothes so as to not draw attention to it. His outfit is quite revealing, but it does cover his legs as well as his upper back so those areas stand out here. This is kind of interesting since the aforementioned Achilles had his weak point in his heel, i.e. in his legs, and there is another invulnerable hero of legend that had his weak point on his upper back, that being Siegfried/Sigurd. In the epic poem Nibelungenlied it was said that Siegfried's skin became extremely tough as a result of bathing in the blood of a dragon, but while he was doing that a leaf landed on his upper back and covered a small area of his body, leaving it vulnerable. The weakness of Balin's magic could be a reference to one of these legendary figures.

Regardless of what the weakness of Balin's magic ends up being, I expect Gawain to make good on her claim of defeating him with just one finger. If Balin's magic has a time limit then she will run out the clock and knock him out with a finger flick to the head, and if Balin has a weak point then she will poke him in that spot with a finger. In the event that it's possible to get past Balin's defenses with just brute force then Gawain will repeat what Escanor did to Zeldris:

About Dareth, I think he could "die" for real in this arc, sacrificing himself to save his brother. Would be a good way to nerf him.
I don't see that happening. Dareth is not just some random aspect of Gareth's powers, but his twin brother who's a major part of his backstory. The chapter in which we learned of their relationship was titled 'The Twin Swordsmen', which highlights that as their special gimmick. This is why Gareth has no other ghosts helping him even though summoning magics are usually built around such versatility. Caperdonich/Gowther even announced that Gareth's Conjuration "summons and controls his ghostly brother" rather than ghosts in general, so it's possible that Dareth is the only ghost he can actually summon at will. This makes sense in the context of what happened with Diodra's magic recently. He felt betrayed by all of his loved ones and succumbed to despair, which resulted in him awakening a magic called Despair whose magic-stealing ability means he can do everything himself and no longer has to rely on anyone else. By that same logic it would make sense for Gareth's trauma of losing his brother to have caused him to develop a magic that allows him to reunite with his twin again by conjuring his ghost. Controlling other people's ghosts isn't something he wanted to do so his magic didn't need to develop that ability.

Getting rid of Dareth wouldn't be a good nerf to begin with, because ghosts normally can't interact with the living. Dareth phases through people and magic so he would be completely harmless if not for his special sword. What is a normal ghost without such a special weapon going to do, make spooky noises at night? Removing Dareth would nerf Gareth into the ground.

You guys are thinking too much about Despair's power IMO. It's literally impossible for Percival to lose this fight. As shown in the previous chapter, even if Percival's attacks get reflected, he himself can heal.
The narrative is more important than the powers. It makes sense for the clash between Percival and Diodra to result in a tough fight given the amount of buildup Nakaba has put into it so far in this arc and all the tension that exists between them, especially if this is to be the start of a more long-term conflict. Additionally, if Diodra is to be recruited by Beltreipe after the tournament, then we can surmise that his performance will be impressive enough to warrant that. I doubt Beltreipe would be interested in a loser who couldn't even pose a threat to his opponent. A close fight also makes sense in the context of the match being in the semifinals, since the whole point of a tournament is for each subsequent round to be more intense and suspenseful than the last. This is true for both shonen manga arcs as well as real life sports tournaments. Everything in the story points to Diodra being a challenging opponent for Percival, even if the outcome of the match is still obvious. This was already true back when Diodra was weak and his only option was to cheat, and it's even more true now after his huge power-up.

As far as the powers are concerned, you shouldn't be looking at just Despair alone but the whole package. Gatekeeper means that Percival will be exposed to Purgatory miasma if he gets close to Diodra, while Invocation allows Diodra to summon monsters to gang up on Percy. Getting past those magics isn't as easy as it was last time either. Gawain blitzed past the monsters and punched Turret in the face, but if the same thing happened to Diodra he would just reflect the damage. Rothes surrendered after Nasiens destroyed the Purgatory rift and then put a sword to his neck before he could recover and create another rift. Diodra has no reason to surrender in that situation because even if Percy stabs him in the neck the damage is just going to bounce back. What Percival needs to do in order to win is to figure out Despair's weakness while simultaneously dealing with the other threats. Defeating the summoned monsters will give him an opening to get close and then he can either destroy the rift or just tank the miasma for a few seconds. That gives him a moment to poke and prod at Despair to see if he can get past it, until Diodra either forms another rift or summons more monsters. Then it's back to square one again and time for another attempt. With each attempt Percival will take more damage and use up more energy. He will eventually succeed of course, but it's unlikely to be as easy as you make it out to be.

When Balin's defence finally shatters do you think he will be elated or actually fold quickly because he has a super low pain treshhold because he barely remembers what pain even is?
Balin's invincibility comes from his magic so if he wanted to feel pain he could just deactivate it, unless it's like Ban's immortality in the sense that it just works automatically. Balin being hypersensitive to pain could very well be the case since he's sort of like an opposite to how Ban was at the start of NnT. Ban was constantly taking lethal damage and he was so used to it that he barely even reacted to fatal injuries like getting stabbed through the chest. If Balin never takes damage then it would make sense for him to be the opposite of Ban in terms of pain tolerance. If Balin has some kind of a weak spot on him, let's say the result of him concentrating all of his "weakness" in one area to make the rest of his body invulnerable, then Gawain might be able to get a funny reaction out of him simply by poking him in that spot. He's a fairly serious character so he could benefit from possessing a minor comedic trait that shows up every now and then for a quick gag.
 

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It is possible that Balin has a second skill, all the new magics seem to have more than one skill, I imagine this happens when Gawain finds Balin's vulnerability.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

Balin says he is looking for an opponent who will change his destiny, this person is probably Gawain who will defeat him, Balin will probably join Gawain to be able to have more exciting fights lmao
 

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Getting rid of Dareth wouldn't be a good nerf to begin with, because ghosts normally can't interact with the living. Dareth phases through people and magic so he would be completely harmless if not for his special sword. What is a normal ghost without such a special weapon going to do, make spooky noises at night? Removing Dareth would nerf Gareth into the ground.
Well, we got updates about Gareth's powers.

The narrative is more important than the powers. It makes sense for the clash between Percival and Diodra to result in a tough fight given the amount of buildup Nakaba has put into it so far in this arc and all the tension that exists between them, especially if this is to be the start of a more long-term conflict. Additionally, if Diodra is to be recruited by Beltreipe after the tournament, then we can surmise that his performance will be impressive enough to warrant that. I doubt Beltreipe would be interested in a loser who couldn't even pose a threat to his opponent. A close fight also makes sense in the context of the match being in the semifinals, since the whole point of a tournament is for each subsequent round to be more intense and suspenseful than the last. This is true for both shonen manga arcs as well as real life sports tournaments. Everything in the story points to Diodra being a challenging opponent for Percival, even if the outcome of the match is still obvious. This was already true back when Diodra was weak and his only option was to cheat, and it's even more true now after his huge power-up.

As far as the powers are concerned, you shouldn't be looking at just Despair alone but the whole package. Gatekeeper means that Percival will be exposed to Purgatory miasma if he gets close to Diodra, while Invocation allows Diodra to summon monsters to gang up on Percy. Getting past those magics isn't as easy as it was last time either. Gawain blitzed past the monsters and punched Turret in the face, but if the same thing happened to Diodra he would just reflect the damage. Rothes surrendered after Nasiens destroyed the Purgatory rift and then put a sword to his neck before he could recover and create another rift. Diodra has no reason to surrender in that situation because even if Percy stabs him in the neck the damage is just going to bounce back. What Percival needs to do in order to win is to figure out Despair's weakness while simultaneously dealing with the other threats. Defeating the summoned monsters will give him an opening to get close and then he can either destroy the rift or just tank the miasma for a few seconds. That gives him a moment to poke and prod at Despair to see if he can get past it, until Diodra either forms another rift or summons more monsters. Then it's back to square one again and time for another attempt. With each attempt Percival will take more damage and use up more energy. He will eventually succeed of course, but it's unlikely to be as easy as you make it out to be.
It doesn't make sense for Diodra to be a tough fight for Percival though. His only saving grace is the damage reflection. I just can't imagine it.

I am not expecting tension because of the difficulty, but because of the core of their relationship and what just happened. With Balin not being receptive to his offer and Gareth befriending Percival, Diodra is the best candidate by default anyway.

The PBs aren't really an issue because Percival can kill them. He doesn't need to hit Diodra.
 
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